Comments on: Jazz Vinyl Update: Some Warhols, Blue Notes & Miles

By: London Calling

London Calling — Tue, 15 Mar 2011 23:52:54 +0000

Scattergun questions?

The only definitive issue of Blue Note Records Inc is Plastylite with ear. I have stuff with 47 West 63rd labels and no ear. Liberty were scavengers, labels are no guarantee of anything.

9M turns up on very early masters created in the late 50′s, which were used for some second pressings beyond that into the early 60′s. I have around a dozen 9Ms – always only late fifties very early 60′s pressings, first or otherwise. All sound great.

Laminated covers appear late fifties early sixties. Most of my NY label Blue Notes (1962-6) if not all are matt finish.

Liberty presings are a “hope and a prayer” The presence of a VAN GELDER stamp is encouraging but sometimes merely an indication of an over-used stamper with dull flat output.

The Blue Black label West Coast UA pressings are a much more lively affair, as are the Michael Cuscuna late seventies Blue label white note Liberty/UA first release of lost archive material. It’s not that the pressings are brilliant, its because the source tapes are brilliant, 1957-63 typically, cant go wrong with what Rudy did.

where are today’s recording heroes? (rhetorical)

By: zarabeth47

zarabeth47 — Mon, 14 Mar 2011 21:59:41 +0000

In my last post I meant to say “My thinking of this is that PLASTILYTE was selling off older machines to reinvest in “better,” more up to date machines (?)
Re: Liberty presses with RVG stamps to deadwaxes …did Liberty ever use 9M as well? I don’t believe so to either(?)
Liberty also didn’t make laminated covers! Thoughts regarding this? These are the things that keep me up at night LOL!
SO, this lp must be closer to late 50s / early sixties like the seller clearly states in his description(he states early/later): http://cgi.ebay.com/SONNY-CLARK-CRIB-BLUE-NOTE-RVG-9M-MONO-47-W-63RD-TOP-NM-/380316972746?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item588ca876ca
Given the last one (being questioned) still sold for $1700. On a different note – Any one check out that LEE MORGAN that went for $2600? (sextet?)WHEW! WHAT A BEAUTY!

By: zarabeth47

zarabeth47 — Mon, 14 Mar 2011 21:00:44 +0000

Labels can be found months/years later and are used up / not thrown away. Newer labels (with R for ex) can be used while the first editions are being pressed. DGs are artifacts from certain machines used to press from the stampers. These machines were used well into the early 70s by BN and other companies. My thinking of this is that BN was selling off older machines to reinvest in “better,” more up to date machines (?) They obviously kept a few.
In other words all the clues collectors look for to pin down an original first press are flawed. They’re definitely a good sign however and I will totally agree with the theory but they are not failsafe.
When did BN stop the “P” / EAR? I have SIDEWINDERS with EARs so they were still using the PLASTILYTE(sic) pressing company well into the mid 60s. These same SIDEWINDERS (most) have DGs as well. There are one sided DG HANK MOBLEY – THE FLIPs if anyone is taking notes! Here’s something I’ve thought of recently – Are there any presses from the Liberty era with RVG etchings(stamped?)I don’t have any if I remember correctly. I do have Liberty presses with VAN GELDER which tell me they didn’t re-stamp the plates and just used old stampers to press copies. Any thoughts?

By: Rudolf

Rudolf — Mon, 14 Mar 2011 11:22:27 +0000

Maarten: excellent pictures of BLP 1576. I always thought that my copy, without “R” and 47W63rd, NY in small print on the labels is the original first pressing. Well, it is not, there is NY 23, in bigger print, which is definitely an authentic first.
Don’t worry, I will enjoy the music anyway.

By: ceedee

ceedee — Sun, 13 Mar 2011 23:42:43 +0000

Maarten-thanks for the Sonny link. Now THOSE are what I call clear and informative photos! Anyone who sells lps on-line,take note(I am).

By: Mattyman

Mattyman — Sun, 13 Mar 2011 22:24:49 +0000

I thought the exact same thing when I saw the label photo of that Sonny’s Crib: the trademark “R” is clearly visible. The Johnny Griffin, 1590, has no “R”. The Sonny, of course the 1576, has an “R” in that auction photo. In other words: someone paid top dollar for not a 1st pressing.

By: maarten kools

maarten kools — Sun, 13 Mar 2011 22:19:14 +0000

i agree..

http://www.popsike.com/SONNY-CLARK-SONNYS-CRIB-RARE-ORIG-BLUE-NOTE-1576-MONO/230500848241.html

By: bryan k

bryan k — Sun, 13 Mar 2011 16:12:17 +0000

Hi.
I think an original would not have the copyright symbol under E in blue note.