Jazz Vinyl Update: Blue Notes, The $1,000 Bin (& More)
Okay, back in the saddle. Let’s look at some of the interesting jazz vinyl we’ve missed on eBay, starting with the $1,000 bin and a few others that came close:
This one has been mentioned several times in the comments, so here it is with picture for the record: Hank Mobley, Blue Note 1568. This was in VG+ condition for the vinyl and VG++ for the cover and it was sold by Euclid Records. The price was $1,944. This one also came from Euclid Records: Lawrence Marable, Tenorman, Jazz West 8. This was an original pressing. The record was M- and the cover was VG+. The price was $1,711.11.
Lee Morgan Volume 3, Blue Note 1557. This was an original pressing. The record looked to be VG++ and the cover looked to be somewhere between VG and VG+. The price was $1,075.
These next few seemed to reach new heights while we were absent:
Wayne Shorter, Night Dreamer, Blue Note 4173. This was a New York USA pressing. The record was M- and the cover was probably around VG++. The price, get ready for this, was $896. Joe Henderson, In ‘N Out, Blue Note 4166. This was similar: M- on the vinyl and VG++ on the cover, from the same seller. The price was also $896. Here’s a third from the same seller going for the same price: Grachan Moncur III, Some Other Stuff, Blue Note 4177. This was M- all the way around and sold for $896. We had sold a copy of this last year for more than $500, which was a record high at the time, which has now been surpassed. Is this the new pricing paradigm for this generation of Blue Notes?
I wonder why the Lee Morgan wasn’t presented with a photo of the label on the b-side as well. What if it turns out that the “R” is on the b-side? Just like what we saw with the Cool Struttin’, a few posts ago; it went for more than 2 grand!
I don’t know if I’ve said it before, but anyone who has never heard “Tenorman” should check it out. It’s easily(and kinda expensively) available on CD and LP as a Japanese press for those who can’t afford the original. I think it is my second favorite Sonny Clark session(as a leader or sideman).
Mike — and your favorite is . . .
Sonny’s Crib, I also like some of the later sessions with Grant Green bur Sonny’s Crib is definately my favorite. Love them all though.
Its not just the top end that is going through the proverbial roof, it’s the middle too.
Mcleans “Destination Out!” $440, Freddie Roach’s “Good Move” (which I picked up earlier in the year for $50 – 1st press, I swear) – $382, and “Brown Sugar” $294.
The testosterone-charged sax players are at a premium, as are some jazz+ funk artists, scarce Grachan Moncur. But at the bottom of the heap, Lou Donaldson, Stanley Turrentine, Blue Mitchel, Jack Wilson, and a fair output of Jimmy Smith, all somehow not in tune with current sentiment, languishing in the $30 bin.
To quote Bob Dylan “something is happening, but you don’t know what it is, Mr Jones”
Mike,I agree w/ you on “Tenorman”. Very nice,but also very under-rated at the same time(perhaps because of it’s scarcity?)Personally,I never get tired of listening to the “Trio” lp w/ Chambers and Philly Joe and the definitive arrangement of “I Didn’t Know What Time It Was”.
Lomdon Calling-I laughed when you mentioned the Jimmy Smith and Turrentine lps “at the bottom of the heap”. I hope you’re sitting down…
http://cgi.ebay.com/BLUE-NOTE-4164-STANLEY-TURRENTINE-JIMMY-SMITH-NM-NM-HOT-/270682421370?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item3f05edf87a
Sonny’s Crib, Dial S For Sonny, Sonny Clark Trio… Indeed gems to play over and over and over and never get bored of them. Still I’m wondering what the others have to say about my initial remark about the Lee Morgan not showing the label of the b-side. There could be a lot of reasons why the b-side label was not depicted. Anyone remember the Cool Struttin’ that went for 2,200 bucks and turned out to have the “R” on the b-side?? 😉
@ceedee: That can’t be true!!! This record is not really rare and the artists are not sought after as well. What is happening with all these Blue Notes of the 4100 series right now? It’s incredible! Is it just because of the seller?
@Mattyman: You’re absolutely right. But maybe it has to do something with the trustworthy seller Euclid.
ceedee: that rice is hilarious!… these prices for those kind of BN’s must be from inexperienced collectors.
Also the bidding system is a part of these sometimes ridiculous prices.
I bought the original Prayer Meetin’ for 25 euros.
rice=price…………
ceedee
Yes I fell on the floor laughing. Two bidders pushed the price from a ridiculous $300 to just short of $700 in the closing six seconds.
I can only conclude one was Jimmy Smiths mother, the other Stanley Turrentine’s mother. No one else would put this price on a record like this.
I have only one Jimmy Smith, and its a wonderful record (as Jimmy plays very little) It’s “Cool Blue” from 1958, GXK 8186 King pressing 1981, mono, feat Tina Brooks,Lou Donaldson, Art Blakey, Eddie McFadden, Donald Bailey. Never given a main Blue Note release, paid $50, live recording – not one of Rudy’s best.
How many Jimmy Smith’s do you need? Rumaging London’s s/h stores Jimmy Smith’s are dime a dozen, RVG, Ear, 47W63rd, no difference, no takers. Same with Turentine.
Sigh.
Hey, London Calling, about the “Cool Blue” from 1958: “never was given a main Blue Note release” changed a few years ago. The full performance was finally re-released on CD in the RVG series. I wrote a bit about it in my guest column. Click the following link from my photopage and continue with the arrow that points to the right; then you can see all about it! 😉
http://picasaweb.google.com/manmatty/BNCDguestcolumn?authkey=Gv1sRgCMqioeui88rJDQ#5536414014356549378
Pretty sure I have a sealed copy of Night dreamer as well as a couple of open copies. Maybe time to sell one.
‘..all the things you could be if Jimmy Smith’s mother was your wife..” 😉
I have studied the results of twelve bumper price auctions on Monday December 27th,and one bidder (1***m) was behind almost all of them, personally pushing up prices by in many cases 50%
Some kind of impersonation is also clear with another ebay account(c***m (private) )almost certainly one individual running two accounts – as their bids were in all cases simultaneous with each other, each ocurring exactly six seconds before the close of each auction. Each of these accounts only ever make bids in <1hr, no exceptions.
By an extraordinary coincidence, all these records were being sold by one seller, roverd-90, Harry Hasbun of Gainsville Va.
Many of the winning bids were exactly $896 or $696.
Smith/Turrentine 4164 was bumped by the 1***m and c***m combo from $312 to $696 in the last six seconds
The Byrd BN 4188 was bumped from $75 to an improbable $449 by the 1***m and c***m combo in the last six seconds.
In just one case does it look like a real bidder won (Dorham 4181)because a higher bid was placed the day before by m***m, foiling the programmed six second snipe.
Gentlemen, a suspicious mind might suggest we are looking at ebay market rigging, shameless and clumsy to boot, by one individual. The bids were so high as to guarantee no postal cost, because they would not need posting, because they already had the record in their hands.
Perhaps with values on Popsike and elsewhere suitably inflated they will find their way back to market at a now bargain price. If they exist in the first place.
Of course this could all be just one massive coincidence, and collector, say "Goldfinger", has a dastardly plan to aquire the world stock of Blue Notes.
Is this sort of behaviousr within the rules of ebay? I'm still pretty new.
London Calling — I understand your skepticism, but I think the bidding processes you are describing are legitimate, based on the way eBay works. As you note, any sophisticated buyer will having sniping software that will place an automatic bid at any point in the process, usually with less than 10 seconds left in the auction. I use this software and time my bids at 5 seconds before the close. If I know I am interested in sniping a record, I will never bid on it before the auction is ready to close. Why tip my hand? Often what bidders will do is place a set amount for a record, say $891. If there is a higher bid, say at $1,015, eBay will accept these two bids, take the $891 bid and automatically add $5 for the high bid so that the person who bid $1,015 will win the auction at $896. To get these high prices, all you need is two legitimate bidders with real interest in the record, money to spend and sniping software. It would be quite risky and probably unnecessary for a seller to be spiking bids at that high level because if there is no higher bid he would have to pay the eBay fees and would be unable to sell his record. My guess is that these two bidders are legitimate and they have money and they are interested in building M- collections of original Blue Notes. More power to them.
Also, Roverd-90 will have a whole lot of identical records to dump if there plan doesn’t work. Ive watched Roverd-90 for years and never seen them sell the same bunch shortly after.
Thanks for your explanations guys. I agree it is quite possible there are bidders seeking to build collections, and there is sometimes no sense I can see how some collectors behave.
However these two accounts bidding must be one person? The odds of two different people bidding on exactly the same records and no others at exactly the same time for exactly the same amount maximum amount from the same vendor must be a trillion to one? Common guys I’m a former statistician by profession.
Since the price is set by the second-highest bidder, whoever he is he is guaranteeing that he wins, but also that he wins at the highest possible price.
If I am right he is effectively bidding against himself. Kind of makes him a complete dummy, but you can’t legislate against human foolishness.
I shall watch with interest the buyer feedback on our roverd-90’s
profile.
Thanks for tolerating this intrusion. I’m a buyer not a seller, so I am happy to declare an interest in lower prices!
I understand skepticism with prices like that and it is fishy. I’m interested in if you find anything else out. Rover-90 is probably in the top-10 of respected Jazz Vinyl dealers on ebay and if there is anything fishy I’d like to know. But I just have trouble believing it. Also, if it isn’t Roverd-90, I can’t see why anyone else would do it. I’ve seen a lot of suspicious stuff on ebay, and I no longer bid with a few sellers. But, since sniping software has been around, you do tend to see a lot of bids will come in at the same time. I use 5 seconds. If Al also uses 5 seconds, it would look suspicious even when it wasn’t.
I shall keep an eye on this, dog with a bone some might say. When 4188 Donald Byrd’s I’m Tryin’ to Find My Way Home – a hard record to like (and I have it)sells for $449, and its top Popsike price ever was $80 and the highest bidder was now $75, either someone’s not paying attention, or someone is trying to increase their annual sales volume clandestinely before the year end, or for some other reason.
Perhaps Nautiluso is back, and this time he has a different plan.He’s become a philanthropist.