Jazz Vinyl Miscellany From A Random eBay Watch List
Going deep into my watch list on eBay to clear out some of the older items that have been sitting there. Let’s start with Ben Webster, Soulville, Verve 8274. This was an original trumpeter logo that was in M- condition for the record and VG for the cover. The final price was $207.50, which presents a question for me to pose here. I’ve noticed that among the Verve/Clef/Norgran records, Webster seems to be just below Lester Young in terms of value, more than Stan Getz, Johnny Hodges, Sonny Stitt, Buddy DeFranco and some of the other Verve regulars, who were either contemporaries or of the next generation. That’s not even counting Ella, Basie, Hampton or Tatum, whose records seem to have fallen off the value charts completely. Anyone care to proffer any theories for the elevation of Webster in the eyes of collectors, assuming you agree with my observation?
Here’s perhaps a case in point: Illinois Jacquet and his Orchestra, Clef 676. This was an original pressing with the trumpeter logo and David Stone Martin Cover. The record was in Ex condition (VG+ for those keeping score at home), and the cover was also VG+. The start price was $85 and there were no bidders.
I had my eye on this one because 1: It’s a record I’ve never owned; 2) It’s an original Prestige and 3) My nephew, who’s in his early 20s, has really gotten into Dorothy Ashby, which I don’t quite understand because he’s not a real jazz aficionado. He just seems to be into the jazz harp: Dorothy Ashby, Hip Harp, Prestige 7140. This was an original New York yellow label in M- condition for the record and the cover. There was just one bidder and the final price was $299.
There was an auction from the seller bobdjukic that we were watching with a few interesting items, such as Booker Ervin, The Freedom Book, Prestige 7295. This was an original yellow label with the New Jersey address. It was listed in VG++ condition for the record and the cover. The final price was $224.50, nothing out of the ordinary. And there was Miles Davis, Sketches of Spain, Columbia 8271. This was an original stereo pressing with the six-eye logo. The record and cover were also VG++ and the price was $169.16.High, but not outrageous, I would say. Finally, there was Billie Holiday, Commodore 30008. This was an original pressing, VG++ for the record, VG+ for the cover. The final price was $181.38.
Dorothy Ashby has been sampled many times by modern Hip Hop producers most notably J Dilla. I would guess that attention has come from that.
Ben Webster peaked during his recordings in the 1950s for Granz, in opposition to Lester Young who was in decline. He is recognized as one of the big tenors. And he was not overrecordedd as say Hodges or Gillespie, which means there are just a handful of classic Webster records. The other Verve regulars, well many have paled, but it is odd to me that Getz, and Gillespie on Norgran and Clef with Stone Martin does not command higher prices. Anyone who have an answer? Once Blue Note is out of reach one should expect other labels would rise. As Prestige is doing,. But then Granz sold a lot more records than did Blue Note at the time, so there is probably greater availability.
That Sketches Of Spain Bob sold isn’t even an original pressing, the original lacks the “CBS” logo on top of the label.
The problem with Norgran is that you never know what you’ll get – visually clean record doesn’t mean it will play nice. In opposite, Blue Note sounds great even in bad condition. And I guess people mostly do listen to records.
I just don’t risk to pay much for Norgran – there’s nothing I can argue a seller over with, ’cause the record looks close to NM, but plays awful.
Ashby’s later titles for Cadet are groovy, Eastern-sounding, and somewhat psychedelic at times. The kids love ’em.
I love the Ashby I’ve heard. Her debut, for Regent, is fabulous.
I love that you can find great condition first pressing Verve records like Bill Evans, Sonny Stitt, Stan Getz etc. for under $50. I have purchased quite a few Verve first editions and it doesn’t break the bank, who knows maybe one day they will be valuable.
@Alexander : you are right with Norgran / Verve records. Visual condition does not match with listening experience, and thats a problem for collectors. Soulville has always commanded high prices. One year ago i auctionned a duplicate Art Tatum / Ben Webster, first press, DG Tpt label, NM supernice record, play tested all along etc etc… i expected it would go for around 100. It eventually went for….20 $. So, i don’t know what to think.
I just think there are alot more Norgran/Verves in circulation. Much bigger pressing runs is my guess. Plus some of the artists are pretty prolific like Getz. I will pay for the early Norgrans for like a Bud Powell; that’s about it.
Webster remains one of the great tenors even today , and he peaked during the 1950s, Then he was not over recorded as Granz tended to do with his big names, Hodges, Gillespie. So we have a handful of classics with Webster that have not paled,. Finally, Granz sold many more records than say Blue Note or Presige, which means there is greater availability even today. But still a bit strange that early Norgrans and Clefs with the outstanding arwork of Stone Martin does not fet h higher prices. I predict it will come prices go up not only on Blue Note and now Prestige but also Roverside, and European labels.
Sorry forr epeating, I thought my previous comment had vanished in cyperspace, but then I wish to disagree with recording quality, most, if not all, are perfectly recorded, especially some of the Billie Holiday records have superb sound quality, but you need of course to play them with a dedicated mono pick up. I have collected these records for many years and there is so much wonderful music there, and the Tatums are precious., and Back to Back has outstanding sound quality.
Let’s be honest. Investing and appreciating are two different things. Musically the masters are aptly named . The label Is not the measure of the art…
The Billie Holiday on 12″ Commodore has at least thee different variations that can only be identified by matrix number. Buyer beware when a seller is claiming first pressing.
David j do you happen to know what those are? Always wondered
There is a date, I believe on side 2, hand etched in the vinyl. I do not recall every variation, but 1959 and 1958 dates exist. There may be others of which I’m not aware. The earliest date would be expected to be the first. I don’t believe that there are any differences in program. Basically, the 12″ is a later pressing of two 10″, which are themselves later pressings of 78s. The Commodore discography in volume 3 of the Mosaic box set doesn’t distinguish the 12″ pressings and lists songs by recording data and catalog number.
Dorothy Ashby: some ten days ago I sold on EBay: D. Ashby “In a minor Groove” New Jazz 8209 for $ 471 and Prestige 7140 for $ 357.
I was amazed by this sales result. I think the main reason is the extreme scarcity, esp. of the N.J.
I sold a Webster on Norgran for $ 333 this weekend.
All the three albums were mintish, in storage since 60 years.
Who knows with Verve. It’s a little bit of all the reasons folks are citing here. I have a nice VG++ Tal Farlow trumpeter label on ebay right now that I’ve tried unsuccessfully to sell twice before. And it’s got what I consider a realistic $10 opening bid. I think Al wrote about Farlow here not too long ago. Not a lot of people even know who he is anymore, so combine that with the fact that it’s on Verve and there’s very little interest.